Friday, July 20, 2012

MKMOT (July 20, 2012)

These are dark days. Do I have to give you a topic?

MMA is a sport. I cannot even believe it's a debate. Dis-cuss???

This balog needs a standing eight. Your apathy is a powerful Affliction. Only you can cure it. It's open.


67 comments:

  1. Wooooo, it's Friday, I've only got a week left at work. Life is good, time to amuse myself all day making jokes with you guys. Wooooo........oh god. God damn it.

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    1. Can't say I understand shutting down comments on that post, though. They actually weren't bad!

      And also - isn't the whole point of Kinja to push trollish comments automatically out of view? If it can't work in a situation like this, when you would expect a large volume of comments (and thus trollish ones being pushed far, far away from the post proper) - when will it ever work?

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    2. Steve -- what post were comments shut down on?

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    3. Interesting. For about an hour, I was seeing no comments on the Batman shooting post.

      Now they are back. Kinja!

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    4. I saw the same. Looks like they changed their mind.

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  2. Well, the votes are in. Gamboa and Echo do not like my MMA jokes, but Shitehawk and Sharting do. After weighting their respective votes based on factors such as credibility and sense of humor, the final tally is 98/2 in favor of me continuing to make MMA jokes.

    In all seriousness, I do not mind people saying what they think is funny or not funny when they put their name to it. I understand where G and E are coming from, and I will probably be a little more selective in posting my MMA jokes going forward. At the same time, I think Sharting explained why it can be funny in yesterday's MKMUB, so there is some humor to exploit there. But it's not something that I need to do every single day.

    In no seriousness, MMA!!1!1

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    1. Let me get this straight - you're gonna put the opinion of some double-anonymous hack and the guy who does those Outback Steakhouse bits over me and a guy who still lists "Shirtless Door Greeter - Abercrombie & Fitch, Summer 1995" on his resume? Unbelievable.

      If you think something's funny, post it. Don't let me tell you otherwise. It's just that you [grits teeth] bring A+ stuff regularly; for me, the MMA bits are D-.

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    2. In this jerkoff's opinion, they're good for a laugh. Keep 'em comin, Ray. And never, ever acknowledge the irony in shitting on MMA when every third word out of your mouth is "marathoner".

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    3. You really do seem to have a little troll itch you just have to scratch. I find the MMA bit funny, and if it keeps you away from Jezebel...go for it.

      But like echo said, you're much funnier when you're humor is not based on others' overwrought reactions.

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    4. YOUR HUMOR. Damn it. Commenting from my phone turns me into somethingsomethingbrokenfemur.

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    5. Thanks -- I know how much that must have hurt to say out loud.

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    6. Wait, how did you know that was me yesterday???

      I've really gotta work on my Guy Whos.

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    7. My last comment was meant as a reply for Echo, but it was dropped below these other two commenters whose names do not sound familiar.

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    8. I guess I don't fully understand the argument that they aren't jokes. If I make a comment that humorously suggests that Martina Navratilova isn't a woman, with the punchline being "Martina Navratilova is a man", that's a joke, right? Same rules apply here, I think.

      That said, different strokes etc. I think the individual comments are smirk-worthy and the routine as a whole is downright funny. We can disagree on that, but they are jokes.

      Perhaps we've moved onto a new joke now? Where one can't possibly make a joke out of the notion that MMA isn't real because it's true. In which case, whoa.

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    9. I'm sorry for leaving three comments in the boxer post. Couldn't help myself though.

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    10. I think they're pretty funny too.

      I'm with Shitehawk. If you say something with the intention of making people laugh, and people laugh, doesn't that make it a joke?

      Either way, I enjoy them. Keep them coming Ray, and apparently SbV8 now too.

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    11. Every time you want to apologize to me for your commenting behavior, remind yourself I'm just some dork sitting at a computer somewhere, just like all the other dorks.

      Every time you want to lavish praise upon me or send me money or food, forget everything I just said.

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    12. No worries, that apology was entirely insincere and directed more at Ray for borrowing his shtick.

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    13. @SbV8 -- I just now saw the MMA comment. I think it's great -- no apology necessary. I actually made the same joke about the tattoo that you did (but 4 minutes later), and for the first time in my Kinja history, I was able to catch it and turn it into something else.

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  3. To clarify, I would never ask you to stop making the jokes. I just could not disagree more wholeheartedly with the underlying premise. I can't believe I should even have to spell out why it's an absurd assertion that boxing is a sport, but adding wrestling, jiu-jitsu, muy thai, and a few other disciplines to form an unbelievably tactical and physically demanding combat competition (that is highly regulated and not corrupt inside the cage, no less) somehow makes it anything less.

    Sharting called MMA fans "the most thin-skinned" something or others. I do not understand this. It seems that boxing fans are always the ones creating this debate. I don't see why you can't like both, or at the very least, respect them. And I am a casual MMA fan, at best. I have no real interest in seeing an event in person, and I can't defend the attire or overall culture of the stereotypical fan. But I respect the living hell out of what those guys (the fighters) do, both physically and mentally. I used to love boxing, the corruption and business side are the biggest reasons I've soured. But in no way would I disrespect legitimate boxers or their fans by questioning it's "sports"ness. I can't understand for the life of me why otherwise seemingly intelligent people do this with MMA. That's kooky talk.

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    1. I actually agree with you, I think. I see no reason why MMA would not be considered a "real" sport. But the funny thing is that on the first two occasions where I happened to make a joke about MMA being staged like wrestling, a million greys/pinks and then burners came out of the woodwork to tell me that I needed to get in the octogon to see how real it is.

      So it seems that some MMA fans have a real issue with this. I think if I ever jokingly referred to baseball as a non-sport, everyone would just ignore me or shrug. But the MMA joke seems to have legs.

      Plus, if I'm being honest, I do feel that most MMA fans get way too into this shit. But as someone above joked, I'm way into track/marathoning, which is about 100 times less relevant than MMA, so who am I to judge.

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    2. I have always understood the joke to be about whether MMA is staged, not whether it's a sport. But I think the goal of the joke is not to honestly suggest either, only to needle a fairly small group of dedicated fans in the condescending voice of "the rest of us". Which was great and funny as hell right up until I explained all the humor right out of it.

      Glad I could help!

      For what it's worth, I think MMA is a sport, is real, and is actually pretty interesting to follow. But I still think the jokes are good. I wouldn't mind someone making the same jokes about boxing, which is a sport I follow with greater interest. If someone developed a funny habit of needling NBA fans about the draft lottery being fixed, if the jokes were funny and the routine was carried out in a clever way, I would love it, even though I am an enormous NBA fan.

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    3. @Ray, @Shite

      Yeah, maybe there's two different debates here. One about MMA, one about the jokes. It's hard for me to find them funny when I disagree so vehemently with what I understood to be the premise. And this whole MMA debate has come up several times, I just felt compelled to defend it. And now that you two agree with me, I can go back to comfortably basking in Sharting's wrongness. Joke away, Ray. It's hard to take you too seriously in those marathon shorts, anyway. Be honest, how much do those slits in the side really take off of your time?

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    4. @Gamboa

      Actually, I was just thinking about those slits on my humid fucking run this morning. As a rule, I do not wear the shorter (8 or 10 inch inseam) running shorts. Just for the obvious style reasons. But the problem with longer shorts in Florida is that as it gets hotter and more humid, the shorts get soaking wet, and they stick to your legs. In addition to that being annoying, it constricts the IT Band that runs down the side of your legs, which does not feel great. So now that it's summer, I am forced to dig into the drawer and find the shorter ones with slits that don't press into my side.

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    5. @Raysism

      Wait, isn't 8-10 inch inseam a longer style of running shorts? I was actually looking at a few pairs a couple of hours ago online, and it seemed like 5-7 inch was the standard short-medium length, with 8-9 being medium-long. Do you normally run in capris? That seems awfully impractical.

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    6. @Sgt. H

      You're right -- I said inseam when I meant outseam.

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    7. I thought the MMA comments were funny simply for the absurdity of accusing the sport of being fake coupled with a fan base stereotypically prone to apoplexy.

      Or whatever you guys said in those novels above.

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    8. @Gamboa -

      It seems to me that you're confusing questioning whether something is a sport with questioning whether it's any good. I wrote up an explanation for why I don't consider MMA a sport that never, at any point, comments on whether it is a fun thing to watch or an amazing athletic spectacle... you will not be surprised to learn that Blogger considers it too long for this comment section.

      I'll happily post it in DUAN this evening if you're interested. The point is that saying that MMA isn't a sport (which I'll do) is not the same thing as saying that MMA sucks (which I might also do, but for totally different reasons that I'm actually capable of compartmentalizing away from my judgment of its sport-ness).

      Bored yet?

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    9. Sharting, please do post that somewhere at some point. If nothing else, it may motivate me to write that piece on why it should be legal to shove someone who talks about the "CrossFit Games" out of a moving vehicle.

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    10. @Sharting

      No. I'm definitely not confusing that. I'm asserting that it's absurd to not consider it a sport, especially for anyone who (rightfully) considers boxing to be one.

      I won't be around for DUAN though. Please don't consider that surrender. You are as articulate as they come, but literally nothing can convince me on this one. I'll read it eventually, regardless.

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  4. A joke is a joke to whoever writes it. Just because certain groups of people don't think it's funny, that doesn't make it any less of a joke. And who the fuck judges comedy anyway? It's subjective, so to shit on people because what they must have obviously thought was funny (or why else would they post it?) is pretty fucked up. Just because some people are funnier than others is no reason to try to make the less funny feel like subpar jerkoffs. That's probably why DS got that elitist/jocko/cool kids table rep in the first place.

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    1. "And who the fuck judges comedy anyway?"

      All of us?

      Also, please direct me to where someone got "shit on." (TWO GIRLS, ONE CUP!1!!!)

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    2. "And who the fuck judges comedy anyway?"

      Everyone on earth, every time you laugh at one thing and don't laugh at another. Every film critic. Every book critic. Every person who watches film and television and listens to music and reads books or magazines or newspapers or comics. Every person who has ever chosen to attend one comedy show and not another. Every single person on earth who has ever said or thought something is or is not funny.

      The statement "it's subjective" is as flaccid and pointless as using the "that's just your opinion" line in a disagreement. Of course it's subjective, but that doesn't mean we can't think and talk critically of something. You complete and total fucking jackass.

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    3. My two cents; I too do not enjoy MMA, but I'm not certain how I feel about ripping it in the comment threads. Considering my favourite sport is soccer, when a novice commenter leaves something insipid referencing how boring soccer is or how many of the players are pussies for diving, I want to tell them to suck a giant bag of turgid cocks. In most instances, I show some tact and take the high road.

      Don't get me wrong; I do enjoy some dialogue about sports and our preferences as commenters. The back-and-forth Raysism had with SSE, I believe, on the topic of Track Vs. Swimming made for some good reading, and as a former competitive runner and swimmer, it both tickled me pink and had me sending pipe bombs to every address in the greater Tampa/St. Pete area.

      Raysism, it pains me to say it, but you are one of the breadwinners around here, and I think while it's a funny narrative for a dozen or so of us who are in on the joke, for those who are not, it just breeds complacency and a lower standard of comedy that all drives us ape-shit mad.

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    4. It's true that I'm one of the breadwinners, but that's only because Same Sad Echo won't leave the house, TDK is constantly at the strip clubs, and Lionel isn't old enough to drive yet.

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    5. Guy Who Just Fell Off a Soapbox in a Comical Fashion Drawing Uproarious Laughter From People Who Find Shit Like That FunnyJuly 20, 2012 at 1:04 PM

      @ Vuvs

      Allow me to rephrase. Who is anyone to judge comedy, when different things make different people laugh? It's like talking to your friend and he says "I like that band." And you say, "They fucking suck, bro!" Why? Because you don't like them, therefore they suck? Obviously your friend doesn't feel that way. It's just mean spirited to tell people they aren't funny when they must find humor in what they're writing. It might not be ready for a comedy show, but someone makes the effort and then they see Shitehawk deconstructing why their joke sucked or someone on here telling them they suck and basically it's cyber bullying. "HA HA FUCKER, YOU'RE NOT FUNNY LIKE THE REST OF US. TAKE YOUR LAPTOP AND GET THE FUCK OUT OF HERE."

      What's the point?

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    6. If your only goal is to make comments that make you laugh, why would you get upset if nobody else laughs? Probably not being honest with yourself there, bub. Get the fuck out of here.

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    7. Cobra, every time there's a soccer post, a full half of the comments are about someone diving. And you know what? The funny ones are funny and the bad ones are bad. And I'm a fairly big soccer fan myself. The argument can't be "you shouldn't make those jokes because some people like MMA!"

      Very long ago, I was sent a guest piece by a certain DUAN-only commenter who took extreme umbrage with jokes about mental illness and death. Her argument boiled down to this: "some people have had mental illness and so mental illness jokes are not funny". Which is totally preposterous! It's funny because I'm fucking laughing at it!

      Raysism's comments aren't "dialogue about sports and our preferences as commenters." They're digs, a concerted and persistent antagonism of a small minority of sports fans, and it's funny because it's bully behavior. They're jokes! And there's no "in on the joke". If you think jokes about Didier Drogba flopping and diving are allowable even if they offend the small and underrepresented group of soccer fans who are unable to take a joke, the same rule applies here. If you're looking for jokes that only illuminate fundamental truths about their subjects, well, look around! Deadspin has never been that place. Every sport that is ever discussed on Deadspin is subject to unflattering humor, and this is just one of the many ways MMA will be on the receiving end.

      NFL gets concussions. NBA gets rigged draft jokes. Penn State will forever get pedophilia. Soccer gets diving. MMA gets this and probably a dozen other things. They're funny whether they're true or not and sometimes because they're not.

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    8. I will never understand how Miserable Shitehawk can put all of the radio waves and electricity that move randomly through my head into words.

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    9. @ BronzeHammer

      Thank you for your response of "get the fuck out of here" which is really, really strong. Well said. I don't see how my trying to have a conversation warranted that, but maybe things like that are why people get annoyed at deadspin commenters, hence burner accounts like that deadspinisgay guy trying to rile everyone up. Just a guess.

      I never said the only goal was to make yourself laugh. What I said was I'm sure that whenever anyone writes a comment, they think it's funny. Of course they hope other people find it funny, but certainly the writer must find it funny to them. So if maybe that person isn't the best comedy making person, they are still making an effort and I don't see what it serves to make them feel like shit because they aren't necessarily funny to other people. I'm guessing being in a duds list or if they happened to see this blog and their joke getting mocked, it might suck for them. But no matter, I'm just going to get the fuck out of here anyway.

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    10. @ Guy Who

      That's such nonsense. You must already know this, but we have brains with frontal lobes so that we can judge things. I'm so sick of that ridiculous point. "Don't judge people!" "Don't be so judgmental!" No, you're right, everything is equally good. Bad movies = good movies. Bad songs = good songs. Stupid people = smart people. Who needs this analytical brain, anyway?

      In the world of intelligent people who pay attention and give a shit about things, we put a lot of emphasis and prestige on a person's capacity to deduce what is good from what is shit. Food critics. Wine tasters. Movie critics. Yelp. Rottentomatoes.com. Travel magazines. Balogs. Believe it or not, there is a difference between what is good and what is not. And you already know this, because you've twice now alluded to the difference between "some people [who] are funnier than others" and some content that is "ready for a comedy show" and some that is not. The difference you're alluding to is the quality of the jokes, not some other mystical thing.

      At Deadspin, we pay a lot of attention to the quality of the jokes. If something fails to sizzle, we look away. If that makes us the cool kids table, I'm fine with that. If a person can't handle having their jokes criticized by some random guy on a blogspot site, nobody told them to look at it in the first place.

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    11. @Shitewhawk

      I agree that no topic is untouchable lest it is approached in a humorous and original fashion. Raysism is one the site's best commenters, and because of this and the adulation he receives from us on many a comment, he is an example to these burner derps. While you and I, as seasoned deadspinners may see the humour in a 'dig' at MMA, perhaps the aforementioned burners see it as an example to post whatever negative drivel they see fit. Considering the amount of discussion around here about frustrations with the new commenting system and the shit it allows, while you may wholeheartedly disagree, I believe my opinion on this topic has some merit.

      Again, just my two cents. As with my jokes, feel free to carve it how you see fit.

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    12. What Raysism MeantJuly 20, 2012 at 2:43 PM

      "I completely understand why I'm blowing you."

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  5. For those of you who haven't had the pleasure of getting a reply from billfuss, just know that he enjoys our comments more than we ever will. To wit:

    http://deadspin.com/5927457/?comment=51130082

    http://deadspin.com/5926986/?comment=51077443

    http://deadspin.com/5926986/?comment=51077482

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    1. Thanks, I'll just tap the addresses until my phone figures out what I want it to do.

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    2. I really need to learn how you folks do that linky magic thing. Sorry.

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    3. Got no problem with BillFuss. He's been very complimentary of me, and what else could I ask for? I hope he'll sign up for a real account and stick around.

      But on the topic of Burners, a quick request of Dom Cosentino, whose work I respect and enjoy: I know the directive is to engage the commenters, but grappling with the lowliest of Burner trolls and idiots only serves to encourage, not dissuade them. There are, I daresay, even serious discussion-y folks more worthy of your consideration.

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  6. I'm perplexed by the kinja order of my comments on the boxer post.

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  7. I'm likely in the minority here but, I think Tulos' post on the NRA tweet and his subsequent justification is wrong. I'm no gun enthusiast by any means just seems silly and a draw for obnoxious discussion.

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    1. I'll be in the minority with you. As soon as I saw that post go up, I groaned just thinking about the ensuing Gawker-like shitstorm it would generate.

      There is a time and place for everything, and certainly a healthy debate on gun control is warranted in situations like this, but at a later time and at a place that doesn't involve the DS comment section (at least in a non-DUAN fashion). Right now, the focus should be on the victims and the incredible, senseless loss of life. Not really a post for deadspin in my opinion, but we are probably in the minority, as you say.

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    2. Agreed. On twitter, I kiddingly said that the pool for Dead Letters must have been dry this morning after that post went up. It served very little purpose other than to generate a flame war.

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  8. I've just spent the last 10 minutes of my life trying to construct a Berenstain Bears-Bonnie Bernstein dialogue joke for the PSU statue post. Sometimes I really hate myself, but not nearly as much as my employer must hate me.

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    1. Didn't she say the Cubs suck?

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  9. Raysism,

    I've been here off and on since the Kinja takeover, so forgive me. What does getting "Kinja'ed in a major way" mean?

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    1. You were definitely the first person to make the Top/Bottom joke, but you, me and SbV8 all did the same thing within the same minute. In the old system, yours would have clearly shown as the first comment, so me and SbV8 would have just changed ours. But under Kinja, it took me several minutes to see you had already made the joke (and by that time, Steve U had already replied to me), and yours actually got pushed to the end, so no one will ever know that you hit Submit first.

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  10. Okay, I have to say something, and I don't know where to say it. It's not funny.
    Columbine is trending on Twitter. Let it go. And if you have to remember something, don't remember Marilyn Manson or Michael Moore. Remember Rachel Scott, my friend, who died there, on the sidewalk.
    Just let it go.

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    1. Ray, I may break it up and post it here, but I'd like to hear from the pro-MMA crowd first whether they're interested.

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    2. Oops, that was intended for Raysism above. D'oh.

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  11. If you're not busy, head over to Jezebel for a Q&A:

    http://jezebel.com/5927487/a-sex-and-love-addict-is-here-and-ready-to-answer-your-questions

    This woman is a former coke and sex addict, who -- surprise -- somehow recovered and wrote a book. Because, you know, now she's an expert.

    The Jezzies have already started to submit their questions, and they are acting like this woman is some sort of shaman with special life-saving expertise. It's crazy. One woman is asking what to do with her husband who watches porn for 8 hours a day as "his hobby". This is going to be great.

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    1. Thanks for the heads up, Ray. At least she thinks I'm funny.

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    2. Yeah, nice response! RMJ=H just submitted a good one.

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    3. Oh man, poke-san, I hope that story is made up.

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    4. "If you're not busy". Ha, as if a group of people reading and posting on an open thread for a balog spawned from a secondary blog that analyzed comments on a tertiary website aren't busy. Way to know your audience, Ray.

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    5. @RMJ: It's amazing how many women have their head stuck in the sand.

      @PT: Good point.

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